The Minister of Health Adonis Georgiadis gave an interview to Vasilis Chiotis for the Sunday print edition of To Vima, where he spoke about the developments in insurance fund and healthcare provider EOPYY, the necessary needs to improve healthcare and the future of healthcare employees in light of the government’s mobility scheme.

Mr. Minister is the condition in Healthcare Organization EOPYY as dramatic as you describe it, or are you exaggerating a bit?
EOPYY is a huge and serious reform that must definitely be completed, Mr. Chiotis. Unfortunately in Greece everything is rushed at the last moment, so there were many structural issues that create even greater problems. Despite the efforts, the serious liquidity problems persist, leading to delayed payment of suppliers and other serious problems in general. I think it is time to begin the great discussion on the purpose of EOPYY.

What can be done to improve the situation at EOPYY?
The experts who advise use– and I am not just referring to foreign experts, but Greek experts too – have many ideas on how EOPYY’s role and operation can change. We will have this discussion without any taboos, even though it is certain that some will be annoyed. For example: the question of whether it will simply be an insurance fund or whether it will continue being an insurance fund and healthcare provider, as it is today, has been put on the table and I think we must have the courage to have that discussion

Are you considering the possibility of EOPYY not providing healthcare services?
We are examining – I stress examine, which means we have not come to a decision – all options on how EOPYY could operate better. That is one of those options.

Does that would mean that EOPYY doctors would be dismissed because there will not be any EOPYY clinics, or that they will be transferred to the National Healthcare System (ESY) and continue working?
There is no way we would come to a decision that would lead to the dismissal of 6,000 doctors, if that is what you are asking me. That possibility is ruled out.

Therefore they will be transferred to ESY…
That is another matter of discussion. When that discussion begins and concludes, we shall see…

If that discussion begins, do you realize the uproar it might cause? The reactions will be so intense that you will either be forced to abandon those thoughts, or the EOPYY clinics will come to a standstill for months.
Let is not prejudge whatever decision we may come to… The discussion has already begun with the Task Force’s report at the start of current year. As I say, we are having various discussions. We have not yet determined what would be the best option. You can rest assured that whatever we decide, whatever that might be, it will be the result of an extended dialog and after we have ensured the circumstances so that no huge commotion is caused.

I understand that you are not rejecting it outright, just like you rejected the possibility of dismissing even one doctor.
Yes, not a single doctor will be dismissed.

Obviously you must be concerned about the participation of the Ministry of Health in the government plans for the second wave of mobility…
Absolutely. The Ministry of Health’s participation in the first mobility wave of 12,500 employees was significant. It must also be significant in the second wave that will take place by the end of the year.

One way or another you have opened a front with the doctors. Your policies give the impression that doctors are responsible for huge deficits in EOPYY’s finances.
First off, the discussion with the doctors is not confrontational. Many doctors, I must say, are in agreement with our initiatives. I honor Greek doctors, they have an excellent reputation abroad and for that they are sought after. I d not consider all doctors crooks and thieves. Obviously though there are doctors who are implicated in the cycle of induced demand that definitely exists in the Health sector, for which the Greek taxpayer has paid dearly. Not only doctors, but definitely some doctors…

In the past doctors have been accused of illegal enrichments and extended tax evasion, but the government accusations were not confirmed from the audits…
We have decided and already begun to use the electronic prescription as a tool of control and we have already submitted the first data at (Association of Scientific Healthcare Personnel) SEYP and SDOE. All doctors will be audited whose specialty or location, based on averages cannot justify their prescriptions, especially ones who –to a great extent – use particular pharmaceutical companies and pharmacies, because they create suspicions of induced demand. I think that in a very short time the evidence on those who have caused the induced demand will be sent to the prosecutor – because I have personally issued this order to SEYP and made the request to SDOE.

And they will stop providing their services to EOPYY?
Absolutely. Any doctor found to have caused induced demand will be dismissed the EOPYY.

If any doctors are found guilty of wrongdoing, will your publicize their names?
There frameworks in place regarding personal data and a Minister cannot violate them. I will not lie, I would like to do so. I am afraid, if I remember the law correctly, there must be final rulings in order to publicize names.

What about prescription of generic drugs? Your latest decrees seem to create the impression that you are abandoning the law on generic drugs in favor of doctor opinions.
The exact opposite is happening. We are running a nationwide campaign for generic drugs. We ask all to help us achieve the national goal of a 60% market penetration for generic drugs. If we do not achieve that goal, we will have failed as a system.

Generic drugs are good, they are safe drugs and if a doctor insists on giving us a non-generic drug for an illness that has been proven to be cured by a generic drug, he creates great suspicion and the patient must be very suspicious.

But when you allow the market name to be written [in prescriptions] along with the active ingredient…
No, no, we have not allowed that anywhere. The decree is very specific. The market name is disallowed. It is also not allowed to be written in the healthcare booklet, where many would handwrite the market name. The penalties for offenders will be harsh and the expulsion from the EOPYY system of doctor who will be found to have written a market name, will be certain and irrevocable.

What happened is that the doctor retains the legally sanctioned discretion of what will be written in the comments. In any case we have clarified that the market name is not allowed. What the doctor will do in the comments is his own responsibility. The pharmacists are explicitly ordered by EOPYY to give the cheapest generic drug of the active ingredient prescribed by doctors. If the patient insists on a more expensive drug, then he will also pay the difference; not the state or the Greek taxpayer.

Will this rumored 25-euro ticket for the medical expenses of hospitals come into effect?
I am glad you have done your homework, because you mentioned medical expenses. It is not a ticket, it is for the medical expenses. A ticket is already in place, it is 5 euros and will remain 5 euros. We have committed though, in the past, that as of the 1st of January 2014, those who admitted in the hospital will pay a 25 euro participation fee. The Greek government took that decision to achieve some goals regarding expenses and the revenue of public hospitals. As we have done a lot better towards that goal, I think we can reexamine it in part and as a whole.

Have you regretted uttering the phrase about firing healthcare workers “so they can see what it is all about”?
It was a phrase directed to the Polyclinic’s leftist unionists who were causing a fuss over their transfer to the ‘Evangelismos’ hospital. What I tried to convey was that in an era where people in the private sector lose their jobs in huge numbers and face long-term unemployment, the image of an employee causing such a fuss over being transferred one kilometer away is excessive. That was the meaning of the phrase.

You know, Mr. Chiotis, as a citizen I always hated the political platitudes and that is the same now that I am a politician. I must say one more thing: I have not been congratulated more in my political career so far for that phrase.